Tuesday, February 17, 2009
Save our hospitals, part 4: The Community
"There's something wrong in this country when they can bail out CitiCorp and all the banks but they can't bail out these hospitals and the people in this neighborhood. We have to keep this hospital open and we'll do whatever it takes. That means the community is supporting you 100%. We're going to make sure Queens Boulevard is shut down next week if they don't keep this hospital open." - Robert Holden, President of Juniper Park Civic Association
"We know the guys and the women who are supporting us and we know those who are not supporting us. You're going to be held accountable when election time comes and this hospital (and Mary Immaculate Hospital) is closed, you're talking 2.5 million people in Queens are going to be affected by this. You hurt us - elected officials, we're going to hurt you by voting you out of office." - Robert Cermeli, Community Board 5 member
See also: Save Our Hospitals, Part 3: Physicians
69 comments:
"We're going to make sure Queens Boulevard is shut down next week if they don't keep this hospital open"
I hate these leftist type tactics even though I agree with the sentiment. 'Because I want this hospital to remain open, I will seriously inconvenience some mom or dad driving home to see their kids.' That is not protest - it is petulant childishness. If the JPCA wants to engage in these type of tactics, they shouldnt count on my renewal $$$ anymore.
Fight the closings. But Abbie Hoffman is dead. Berkeley is thousands of miles away. The 60's are 2 generations old. GROW UP!!!!
"Because I want this hospital to remain open, I will seriously inconvenience some mom or dad driving home to see their kids."
You know what will seriously inconvenience some mom or dad? Driving their sick kid to the hospital and finding it closed.
If they did this in France the whole country would go on strike. But you think closing down Queens Blvd is a communist plot? How dumb can you get?
"If they did this in France the whole country would go on strike. But you think closing down Queens Blvd is a communist plot? How dumb can you get?"
Maspethian is just another Gallagher lackey, who sees the name Holden or JPCA and loses control of his bowels. Remember, Gallagher's lackeys always used to take care of his bowels lickety split.
How about we shut down ALL of New York (perhaps the subways?) and stop only when both hospitals get fully funded, with a new and realistic medical service reimbursement contract?
Then, how about we have all the indifferent politicians get real jobs flipping burgers?
In France they have long realized
that the citizens must make their government afraid of them and not the citizens fearful of their own government!
Too bad our lax Queens citizenry
isn't "man enough" to break the chains that the Manton/Crowley clubhouse has put them in!
Instead,
it's fear that rules their house!
They tremble at the specter of retaliation if they don't behave themselves!
Bravo JPCA!
Step #1 is to get our lazy double dealing pols to notice this grave situation!
After all, if your government is hard of hearing you have no choice but to shout out.
It's not about reliving the Berkley 1960s...it's about reclaiming your human rights that you willfully relinquished.
I cannot abide a stupid coward!
Fuel up on Wheaties and take your place at the front you weenie!
"Don't tread on me"!
Where is Joe Crowley and Chuck Shumer - probably an eating expensive lunch on you folks, helping the Senator from Wyoming to work out a deal to secure funding for Moose crossings from the bailout bucks.
I want to see the hospitals saved, but dumb comments like those from Holden hurt more than help. This guy needs someone to save him from himself. Also, trying to compare this to saving one of the world's biggest financial institution, which if it failed would cause worldwide financial distress and possibly tip the country into another great depression, is another bad tactic.
I still would like to hear why St. John's is not financially viable when it is so incredibly busy. Saying it takes insured and uninsured doesn't answer the question.
I am troubled by Mayor Bloomberg's comment that the city-owned hospitals can handle everything ... after all, it was a city-owned hospital in Brooklyn which watched a woman in the ER die while begging for help ... if that's the kind of handling we can expect from city-owned hospitals, why bother?
"trying to compare this to saving one of the world's biggest financial institution, which if it failed would cause worldwide financial distress and possibly tip the country into another great depression, is another bad tactic."
Citicorp did it to themselves by buying into the subprime mortgage fiasco and throwing their name up on stadiums for hundreds of millions of dollars. The hospitals, FOR THE FINAL TIME, get 1/2 the reimbursement that larger hospitals get for providing the same service, and it doesn't COST them less to do so. It has less to do with insured vs. uninsured than it does with the fact that even if they had a population that was 100% covered, they would still be playing catchup with the likes of LIJ.
Now why don't you lay off Holden and anyone else that was out there protesting and learn about how hospitals work in this state. It just may surprise you what goes on.
Yeah, seriously, talk about blaming the victim. We are all victims of these hospitals closing and there's no need to attack someone who is trying to see that they stay open. Screw Citicorp, if they go under, I'll survive. If I'm having a heart attack and no one is at St. John's to help me, I may not survive.
Yes, some people don't seem to grasp the life-and-death nature of these closures. If CitiCorp is not bailed out, no one's going to die except maybe the execs jumping out windows.
OMG, While St Johns may have lower reimbursment rates than LIJ and while they handle more un insured patients, the REASON this hospital is going under is.....
Corruption! Corruption by an unscrupulous Board of Directors, an equally theiving administration and an under the table deal with North Shore where everyone comes out ahead except the community & the employees.
St Johns is the victim of fraud and the board of directors should be investigated. In fact many people should be investigated including Department Chairs who sat back & did nothing as the hospital was raped.
St Johns is the victim of COPPUPTION pure and simple and I hope it comes to light because I would love to see a class action suit against them.
Ok, it's the victim of "coppuption". So that's up to the AG's office to determine. Have you contacted him?
Trust me, the reason that these hospitals failed had very much to do with poor manangement and accountability, and less to do with patient demographics and differential reimbursement rates. To my fellow blogger who states that the Department Chairs should take some blame....you are absolutely right! These physicians are designated leaders in the hospital who were responsible for assuring the integrity of the teaching program and the quality of care provided by their departments. They supported administrative decisions that adversely affected the care of the patient, and ultimately the viability of the hospitals. As long as their lucrative salaries were protected, they quite simply did not voice an opinion....and now they have the audacity to rally to keep the hospitals open.
Paging Andrew Cuomo. Where is our Attorney General in this scenario? Mr. Cuomo grew up in Queens and attended school here. I would think he would be concerned about our hospitals closing and endangering Queens residents. This situation and the hospital board needs to be investigated asap. As for our local politicians, someone better explain to them that if the hospitals close, they better kiss their political asses goodbye. They better start working for their constituents or they will be voted out. The taxpayers of Queens are fed up with their Queens Clubhouse. We have the power to vote them out! Let's lean on them big time!!!
A little rally will not do shit. Poli-crooks do not really care, we all know this by now. It is time for some direct action people - you want to get people's attention??? Especially in front of mindless shoppers at Queens Center? Block off traffic on Queens blvd - WORKERS OCCUPY THE HOSPITAL - Arrests will be made, but the arrests are far more significant than having a small rally with scumbag poli-crooks.
While we are blocking off traffic - have people who do not want to get arrested hand out flyers to let people know what is happening with the hospitals -
why is the US govt sending money to build (or rebuild) Iraqi hospitals. What about my hospitals?? DEMAND THE SERVICES! POLITICIANS ARE OUR BITCHES, WE ARE NOT THEIRS!
"But you think closing down Queens Blvd is a communist plot?"
No, I likened the JPCA's position to that of petulant teeagers attending a pathetic institution of left wingers. Did you fail your Regents English exam? Maybe Queensborough CC has a comprehension course for you. Sorry, a high school degree might be a pre-requisite.
"Maspethian is just another Gallagher lackey, who sees the name Holden or JPCA and loses control of his bowels."
I echo my comments above for this sport. In my comment, I said I agreed with the JPCA. I belong to the JPCA, which I also made clear. If disagreeing with their tactics in your eyes means I am a rapists' lackey, then you are pathetic. You also seem to have a feces fetish. Get help.
Reductio ad absurdum, ad hominem, et al.
Maspethian: So don't go to the protest!
End of issue.
Of course I will avoid it. Do I have a choice? Now lets get a commitment from the NYPD to arrest those at the protest who break the law.
Sometimes civil disobedience is called for.
Shutting down QB is not going to keep the hospital open. Do a die-in at the ER and spare innocent commuters the trouble for your grandstanding.
How do you do a die-in when the ER is already closed?
Dear Maspethian:
When St. John's Hospital closes I hope you and your family never have to go an emergency room.
You're worried about being inconvenienced on QB while the health and well being of thousands are being threatened with this closing.
Thank God the Juniper Valley group is adding their voice to the fight. I wish I had a group like that in my neighborhood.
I'll gladly get arrested if it will help bring attention to this fight to save St. John's.
"Shutting down QB is not going to keep the hospital open."
So what's your suggestion? You like many others would rather just give up than fight. Keep watching TV in your little rat hole while Bloomturd keeps destroying the neighborhood around you.
"...Sometimes civil disobedience is called for..."
I AGREE 100%, IT'S ABOUT TIME THE PEOPLE OF QUEENS WOKE UP, MAYBE SHUTTING DOWN QB WILL JOLT THE MASSES.
So, let me hear from one in this petulant children's brigade, when you close QB, how 'closed' will it be? Will it be closed for the police? Firetrucks? Ambulances? I have, about half a dozen times, used QB to take my father to a cardiologist. Will it be closed for me? Before you say something stupid, remember, I am AGAINST the closing of these hospitals. I am beginning to think that the reason Queens gets screwed is because there are enough dumb people who dont know who the enemy is and who is on their side.
Please tell us Maspethian, you are obviously all knowing, what should we do? Should we just gripe on QC and other blogs like you? Or should we just move out like Bloomberg wants us to do?
There is a vast difference between shutting down a critical throroughfare and posting on a blog. I dont have a blackboard for ya, so I'll let you fill in the details. And to suggest that I am not active in my community, and even on this very issue, just proves that you do not know me.
MASPETHIAN: Desperate times call for drastic measures. GROW SOME BALLS AND STOP JUST THINKING OF YOUR OWN LITTLE SELF-CENTERED WORLD FOR A CHANGE.
"I have, about half a dozen times, used QB to take my father to a cardiologist."
oh, it's all about you Maspethian. I get it.
"Desperate times call for drastic measures."
Did you lift that quote from one of the lil tards tree sitting at Berkeley or did you craft it yourself?
"I have, about half a dozen times, used QB to take my father to a cardiologist."
"oh, it's all about you Maspethian. I get it."
No, it was about my father, dim bulb.
No, it was about my father, dim bulb.
What about the rest of us? Asshole.
"What about the rest of us? Asshole."
So, its your position that by not breaking the law. I am damning the enire boro? If so, I congratulate you on coming up with such a contorted example of pretzel logic.
"GROW SOME BALLS"
Wow, you are muy macho. You sound like a real tough guy. Almost Geraldo Rivera-esque. [typing while quivering]
Please everyone just knock it off. This isn't helping the hospital situation any.
This is SOP for Holden. Even if they have a good argument, it gets entirely lost in his immature, unprofessional behavior and dumb rhetoric.
If Citi fails, put the unemployment rate at 15-20% of this country and get ready for a major depression. Maybe you don't care, or more likely are not able to understand, but that would be a national and local nightmare.
Supporting the hospital shouldn't be an attack on saving Citi. By making this your argument you are making a losing argument. These are two different matters and both Citi and the hospital should be supported.
To say that Citi did it to itself is irrelevant and shows a fundamental lack of understanding of the economic and financial consequence of it failing. Also, it seems that some contend that the hospital's administration did this to itself, but I don't believe that is a reason to let the hospital fail either.
Crapper, you and the JPCA should stop getting into these arguments if you are just going to screw them up.
His point was that our priorities are screwed up in this country. And I agree with him. Life and death should be taken care of first, not the bottom line of banks.
I guess the anti-JPCA crowd also thinks Chrysler should be bailed out (again) instead of money going toward St. John's and MIH. Great priorities, morons.
Crapper, you and Holden just don't know what you are talking about. Supporting Citi is not just about saving a bank. It is about saving hundreds of thousands of people from losing their jobs and means to support themselves and their families. Saving Citi IS a major national and global priority and it should be. Trying to prioritize it with saving the hospital is a false choice and an argument that you will lose, which is why doing so is just making a mess of things. Focus on the hospital's importance to the community and stop trying to set up a contest between saving the hospital and saving hundreds of thousands of jobs nationwide.
The point is if one can be done, so can the other. Do you not understand that the amount that the hospitals need is a pittance compared to the handout given to Citi? And we can't do it? For shame.
"Supporting Citi is not just about saving a bank. It is about saving hundreds of thousands of people from losing their jobs and means to support themselves and their families."
Supporting St. John's and MIH is not just about saving hospitals. It is about saving thousands of people from losing their jobs and means to support themselves and their families. Honestly I think there are some retarded people posting on here. It's ok to save the jobs provided by a global corporation but not those provided exclusively in our own backyard to our friends, families and neighbors? Get your heads out of your asses and stop espousing nonsense.
Wall Street's self-serving view of the unique role of financial institutions is mirrored in the two agencies that run the American economy -- the Treasury and the Fed. Their job, as they see it, is to keep the financial economy "sound," by which they mean keeping Wall Street's own investors and creditors reasonably happy.
Because the public doesn't understand the intricacies of finance, it's easily persuaded that this is definition of "soundness" is the same as keeping savings flowing to the banks so that the banks can lend to them to Main Street. That's why the public and its representatives have committed $700 billion of taxpayer money to Wall Street and another $500 to $600 billion of subsidized loans to the Street from the Fed -- bailing out the investors and creditors of every major bank, including , any moment, Citi -- only to discover, at the end of this frantic and unbelievably expensive exercise, that American jobs and communities are more endangered than they were at the start.
Shame that everyone is focusing on what is said in the first video and not the second.
The legalized looting of the Treasury continues apace. The Fed apparently reached an agreement to guarantee $306 billion worth of Citibank's shitpile and toss them $20 billion in cash from Paulson's slush fund. And what are they going to do with the money? Send 1,000 jobs to the Philippines.
"Shame that everyone is focusing on what is said in the first video and not the second."
Right, like that will happen, we keep voting for the same jokers.
Paterson is 30 pts behind Cuomo in the primary.
How about Taxpayer Field? We should pay for that but not the hospitals? Ratner's project in Brooklyn? How about it? Which are we willing to sacrifice?
Saving Citi is not about saving the jobs of the bank's employees, it is about saving the jobs of workers of all sorts of businesses all over the country.
I'm not saying that Citi should be saved instead of the hospital. They should both be supported. I am saying that raising the argument comparing support of Citi to support of the hospital, and pitting it as one being more important than the other, is stupid and self-defeating.
The comment about blocking Queens Boulevard is also dumb. It is all about trying to bring attention to the speaker instead of the issue.
:::YAWN:::
If it wasn't Holden saying it, you wouldn't be bitching. If any one of these dumb ass pols said it you'd be pumping your fist in agreement. When you speak at a rally, you try to get a rise out of the crowd, and he successfully did that. Now go be miserable somewhere. You've beaten this topic to death.
Where was the Queens Civic Congress during this whole thing?
The Eastern Queens Civic Congress doesn't give a shit about anything that happens west of Bayside.
I love empty threats. There's no way your going to shut The Blvd down, you don't have the guts to get arrested for anything or anyone. Your so full of it.
This so funny can't wait to see what won't happen.
hahahahahah
i dont trust any of these politcal people..bottom line this whole situation is CORUPT & DISGUSTING!
i blame ADMINISTRATION, POLITICANS,THE DOH, & the list goes on...
its sad that they allowed people to freeze in the cold infront of these hospitals and in albany chanting while inside there were shady deals going on!
Some please check out Eddie Antione and what his role in this was ( get off your cell phone your not that important who are you talking with?)
Annette Hastings, HOW does it feel hiding in your office upstairs while hundreds of employees are packing there things crying after putting in years of hard work?
Is any one going to investigate the corruption and books ever?
the pink rapist loser dennis gallagher is in the building.
Wow, I feel dumb to learn so late in the game that 'civic association politics' is more pathetic than Bloomturd politics.
I am against the hospital closures but dont want to shut down QB, so that makes me a GALLAGHER SUPPORTER????
If the people who post here want to achieve their objectives, they need to isolate and focus on who their enemies really are. That means that you WORK WITH the people who agree with you, about how to DEFEAT THE bad people who disagree with you.
Sounds like y'all want to sound off your way to irrelevance and ineffectiveness instead of saving 2 hospitals.
If Saint John's or Mary Immaculate Hospitals finally close, then, those who live nearby will be in danger when time is of the essence in getting treated.
If Citigroup fails (and it will, because it should), account holders will be inconvenienced, but will be able to switch to any other of the hundreds of banks. Distance from the bank is not critical - it may relate to convenience, but certainly not life or death. Nowadays, we can all bank online, where distance is meaningless.
Hospitals cannot outsource any services, staff, supplies, doctors and equipment must be on the premises and operational at all times.
Citigroup will outsource as much of its services as possible (and profitable). Using taxpayer dollars to "rescue" the Citigroup imbecilic management, will result in having many of those dollars travel out of the country.
For politicians to value the survival of Citigroup is criminal, especially when those politicians value money over life and health.
$306 BILLION to the morons at Citigroup. The politicians couldn't find the sufficient funds to rescue these two hospitals?
Shouldn't Porker Schumer and Smirky Weiner be answering to the people of Queens for their criminal valuation? Remember, Weiner actually wants to replace Commissar Death and Taxes.
Both these criminals gave Queens the finger. Let's return the salute!
Sue the public advocate for not doing her job.
That should get some attention.
Dear Preacher Maspethian,
Please step down from your pulpit and try doing something constructive, it actually feels good. And BTW, if you're going to attack volunteers who are trying to do something to save the hospitals, try to find the courage to type in your real name and stop hiding behind your keyboard taking cheap shots.
Taxpayer, you have zero knowledge of banking, investment banking, the securities industry, economics or the effect of failure of Citi. This is much more complicated than the branch banking that you have in your mind. Stop wasting people's time trying to write opinions about things of which you have absolutely no knowledge.
Maybe Taxpayer's detractor can answer this comment instead since he's so knowledgeable.
Bob R, in a vague way, I believe is saying that supporting the financial and banking system in this country is not necessary and that the public is being into thinking it is. This is a ridiculous statement with no rational analysis or factual support. Just look what happened after Lehman was allowed to fail. If Citi were to fail, the consequences to the entire economy and job market would be disasterous.
Again, raising this stupid argument about Citi is diverting attention away from the real merit-based argument in favor of saving the hospital. It goes to show how Crapper and the JPCA can make a mess of the argument by being so attack-oriented and obstinate.
You're the one who seems to be diverting attention back to the Citicorp argument time after time after time and away from the real issue which is the hospital. If you don't like the Crapper or the JPCA, write them a letter. We'd like to get past your hangup here, thanks.
Like bailing out Lehman would have helped the situation. We're bailing out car companies supposedly to save jobs, yet they are still laying people off. What does that tell you?
It tells me that you have no idea how the financial system works and have no capability to understand the consequences of the failure of a major financial institution. You have no concept of how Lehman's failure affected far more than the jobs of Lehman's employees.
Everyone - enough talking against the bank bailouts in order to make your point about the hospital. It is a losing argument. Focus on the hospital itself.
We were willing to stop talking about it many comments ago. You're the one who can't let it go because of who said it. Get a life.
"Please step down from your pulpit and try doing something constructive, it actually feels good. And BTW, if you're going to attack volunteers who are trying to do something to save the hospitals, try to find the courage to type in your real name and stop hiding behind your keyboard taking cheap shots."
Look above. My comments were very simple. You address none of them. Your 'attackin volunteers' comment is kinda silly.
All I said is that it is stupid to close down QB. I think it is a pathetic TACTIC. But as I said, I agree with the position that we should fight to keep the hospitals open. AND I HAVE MADE MY CASE AND WILL CONTINUE TO DO SO!!! I AM AND AWAYS HAVE BEEN MAKING MY FIGHT TO SUPPORT THIS CAUSE AND FOR YOU TO QUESTION ME FOR THAT MAKES YOU SORELY LACKING IN INFORMATION, I am so inclined towards doing so, but it might make me look like you.
Do I keep my anonymity here? YES!!! And look at the blog you post on. Take the blog owner to task!!! I dont and never will. Some people have jobs that could be sacrificed if they were identified.
I wish you would revise your comments. They dont reflect the things I have expressed, nor the things I believe.
Is it safe to go outside yet?
Caufbert Holden is the Casper in the Juniper.
Post a Comment